The Nets Power Forward Outage
by Mark Ginocchio
Mar 2, 2010 Analysis, Josh Boone, Kris Humphries, Yi
With far and away the worst record in the NBA and the league’s worst offense, it’s no surprise that statistically speaking, outside of the center position, that the Nets have been outplayed by their opponents at every spot on the floor this season. However, when looking at season stats for the Nets production by position courtesy of 82games, I was interested by just how poorly the team has performed at the PF position.
Overall, Nets power forwards, which include Yi Jianlian, Kris Humphries, Josh Boone and at the very beginning of the season, Bobby Simmons, have put up a Player Efficiency Rating (PER) of 11.4 this season, while opposing PFs have a PER of 19.5 against the Nets, good for a differential of -8.1. Not only is this the worst PER differential at the position in the entire league, but only one team, Sacramento comes relatively close in terms of this dubious honor, with a PER differential of -6.4 at the PF position.
For the season, Nets PFs are averaging (per 48 minutes), 15.3 points, 10.3 rebounds, 1.2 blocks and an effective field goal percentage of .423, while allowing their opponents 22.3 points, 11.3 rebounds, .9 blocks and an eFG of 52 percent. When looking at opponents scoring output for all five positions, the PF average of 22.3 is the highest.
On the plus side, despite conspiracy theorists nicknaming coach Kiki Vandeweghe “Yiki,” Nets PFs are tied with the SF position for fewest field goal attempts on the team with 14.4 per game. So, at least the organization acknowledges the deficiencies at the position by not designing an offense geared towards getting Yi and company more shots.
But what’s most alarming is just how well opposing PFs are playing against the Nets, indicating the team’s defensive issues at the position. While Yi looked impressive on the offensive end when he initially came back from his injury in December, he was still unable to demonstrate any improvement on the defensive end. The same could be said for Kris Humphries, who, with increased playing time in New Jersey, has shown many of the same traits that Nets fans slam Yi for – a propensity to take jump shots at poor times, and poor defense. Opposing PFs are putting up a PER of 22.4, with 26.7 points and an eFG of 59 percent when Humphries are on the floor.
The conclusions that can be drawn from these numbers should be obvious: upgrading at the four has to be a priority for the team this off-season. With free agents-to-be Chris Bosh and Carlos Boozer already indicating that they have no desire to play for the Nets, it will be interesting to see how the Nets will go about upgrading the position. But unless the Nets want to continue dealing with a huge deficit at the position next season, the status quo can not be the same. Yi, Boone and Humphries can not get the bulk of the playing time at the four next season, unless the Nets get significantly better at the other four positions to compensate.
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:09 AM
It’s going take a miracle to get LeBron. And I think your analysis of the PF slot is spot on. Either Amare or David Lee need to be a primary target this offseason. Save the rest of the cap room and target Melo for Brooklyn. I honestly believe he’d love to play in Brooklyn. Isn’t he from there?
But in regards to PF… again… I think Lee might even be optimal. Amare may take away from Lopez?
2012
Harris/Turner/Melo/Amare/Lopez
Wall/Lee/Melo/Amare/Lopez
Harris/Turner/Melo/D.Lee/Lopez
Wall/Lee/Melo/D.Lee/Lopez
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:58 AM
I love D.Lee from watching a lot of Knicks games, and he seems still under-rated, but don’t we need more defense? Amare and D.Lee both don’t bring that to the table. I wish there was a way to steal a guy like Serge Ibaka from the Thunder, and then draft guys like Wall or Turner.
This team will hopefully have enough fire-power next year, but why overpay for a second tier guy or 2? Instead let’s save some money and build slowly like the Thunder did.
Harris is legit, maybe not a starting PG on a championship team, but maybe he can play the 2, Wall or Turner are both all-star potential, Lee is good when he is not go-to-guy, Terrence will only get better, and Brook is one of the best centers in the league. Let’s not be stupid and spend money just because we have money
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:58 AM
I love D.Lee from watching a lot of Knicks games, and he seems still under-rated, but don’t we need more defense? Amare and D.Lee both don’t bring that to the table. I wish there was a way to steal a guy like Serge Ibaka from the Thunder, and then draft guys like Wall or Turner.
This team will hopefully have enough fire-power next year, but why overpay for a second tier guy or 2? Instead let’s save some money and build slowly like the Thunder did.
Harris is legit, maybe not a starting PG on a championship team, but maybe he can play the 2, Wall or Turner are both all-star potential, Lee is good when he is not go-to-guy, Terrence will only get better, and Brook is one of the best centers in the league. Let’s not be stupid and spend money just because we have money
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:58 AM
I love D.Lee from watching a lot of Knicks games, and he seems still under-rated, but don’t we need more defense? Amare and D.Lee both don’t bring that to the table. I wish there was a way to steal a guy like Serge Ibaka from the Thunder, and then draft guys like Wall or Turner.
This team will hopefully have enough fire-power next year, but why overpay for a second tier guy or 2? Instead let’s save some money and build slowly like the Thunder did.
Harris is legit, maybe not a starting PG on a championship team, but maybe he can play the 2, Wall or Turner are both all-star potential, Lee is good when he is not go-to-guy, Terrence will only get better, and Brook is one of the best centers in the league. Let’s not be stupid and spend money just because we have money
March 2nd, 2010 at 1:49 PM
The article shows how bad we are in the 4 spot defensively and people wanna bring in Amare and David Lee?
Amare is one of the worst defenders in isolation situation in the entire nba.
David Lee? Zach Randolph 31 pts 25 rebs. Marc Gasol 25 points 13 rebounds 8 assists. Right.
Even though he’s a headcase, I might venture into trying out Tyrus Thomas. He’s a nutjob alright, but he’ll get his minutes here and he still is a pretty good defensive player
March 2nd, 2010 at 2:00 PM
If you have that much faith in Tyrus Thomas becoming a great NBA player, then I agree. I still see him is less of an upgrade than Amare or D Lee.
March 2nd, 2010 at 2:11 PM
Tyrus Thomas can’t can’t shine Stoudamires shoes, he will never put up 40 and 13 or 30 and 13, what Stoudamire does is intimidate players tho, kinda like what Matin used to but on he offensive end, look what happened to Jefferson other day.
March 2nd, 2010 at 2:15 PM
The problem is if your just going to get a Power Forward based on defense alone, your going to end up with Chuck Hayes is that what you guys want lol. Take Amare if you can get him he’s worth it, I would take D-Lee second.
March 2nd, 2010 at 2:55 PM
I agree with Amari, it’s Amar’e then Lee. It’s not as if other teams will always feed it to their 4 because that’s the one spot where the Nets are vulnerable on defense. We’re vulnerable everywhere.
Of course, we might end up drafting Derrick Favors, which would mean we could go for the best available free agent regardless of position. Getting Wall or Turner would make it less likely that we’d go after Wade or Joe Johnson.
March 2nd, 2010 at 4:22 PM
Mark, who should we go for at the PF position in your opinion?
March 2nd, 2010 at 5:20 PM
I think Lee would be a great fit for the Nets.
Having Bosh, Boozer or Amare will take away from Brooks development into a HOF center.
Lee rebounds well, hustles on D, shoots the 15 ft jumper and doesn’t need 20 touches to get his points.
All that for 10 mil per yr? Great!
The Nets could also draft a PF with the Mavs 1st rd pick
There are some nice big men in this draft.
Monroe
Aldrige
Cousins
Favors
Monroe
Robinson
Harongody
March 2nd, 2010 at 6:13 PM
Actually, if you go a bit deeper into the stats at 82games.com, they break down each individual player’s performance (PER) by position too. And some of that info is interesting.
Bobby Simmons, for example, actually played pretty good defense when he played at power forward (opponents’ PER was 14.1), but his own PER was godawful (9.3). The most interesting thing that I see, though, is that BY FAR the Nets best defender at the PF position was … (wait for it) … Sean Williams. When he played PF, the opponents’ PER was only 9.1 (and Sean’s own PER was 12.8). It was only when Sean played Center that he was completely overmatched (opponents’ PER was 16.2 and his own was 3.2).
But, yes, the Nets highest priority this off season is to acquire an NBA-caliber power forward, because they don’t have any on the roster right now.
March 2nd, 2010 at 6:17 PM
[...] The Handlebar: Mark Ginocchio looks at how the Nets power forwards have been vastly outperformed this season by the opposition. [Nets Are Scorching] [...]
March 2nd, 2010 at 7:17 PM
Evan turner playing tonight at 9:00 on ESPN
March 2nd, 2010 at 8:34 PM
Defense at the PF position wouldn’t be a huge issue if we had a PF that could score and rebound at a high rate. If Yi could put up 20 and 8 but give up 22 and 10, it’s not as important as if he’s giving that amount while putting up 6 and 3. This is why I hate throwing Hassell on the floor. He might play decent defense but he’s not gonna spread the floor, make plays or score. If we really need him on a good scorer, he’s not going to shut them down. “Making them work” for their points is meaningless. We get lit up on the regular. I’d rather put Courtney Lee on the wings since he’ll be a factor no matter what.
Amare and Lee would help us tremendously even if they aren’t good defenders. Amare’s an elite scorer off the pick and roll and in iso situations. DLee is an automatic 10 boards a game plus great in the pick and roll. As long as they don’t take away from Brook’s touches, I wouldn’t mind either of them.
March 2nd, 2010 at 10:37 PM
Would have won many more games if They had a quality 4 like dlee. Double double every single night. Even when he struggles, the intagibles are still there,unlike Yi who gives up and chucks up ill-advised shots.
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:04 PM
I personally think David Lee would be the ideal pickup for PF. Like DJ said, he doesn’t need 20 touches to get his points. So he can still score without taking too many touches away from Brook. Also, he might not play great defense, but what he does do is rebound the ball. So he might not be great at preventing the other team from scoring on their first try, but you can almost guarantee he will prevent second chance points because he won’t let the other team get offensive rebounds, which has really killed us this year. So in a way he can help the defense.
March 3rd, 2010 at 12:09 AM
Wooooo, the Nets made Yahoo! frontpage! (for their innovative marketing tactics to get fans to come watch games)
March 3rd, 2010 at 12:12 AM
I agree with Chris. Confusing. There are two of us.
March 3rd, 2010 at 2:20 AM
yeah Chris, I guess that could get a little confusing, I’ll go with Chris B. for now on instead of Chris
March 3rd, 2010 at 3:20 AM
Speaking of trenton hassell, felt like he played a lot better at the beginning of the season when he was forced to carry some offensive load.
March 3rd, 2010 at 5:57 AM
What’s wrong with Chuck Hayes? Last time I checked he does a pretty good job on the defensive end.
Everyone rags on Chuck Hayes, I have no idea why. He’s a really good defensive player. And at his height too, he’s making guys a lot bigger than him struggle to score. Is that supposed to be bad or something?
I’m not looking for a guy to put up big points, that what we have Brook Lopez for. We need defense, and on that aspect alone Tyrus Thomas is head and shoulders over Amare and Lee.
March 3rd, 2010 at 9:52 AM
I’d take Thomas over Lee any day of the week. We need D. Lee is an atrocious defender.
March 3rd, 2010 at 11:58 AM
We really need whatever talent we can get. I’ve read here I think that Brook’s lateral movement on defense is a little slow, so an athletic PF who defends well would be a huge asset, but so would a guy who can hit the 15-20 ft. shot and keep the D honest so Brook can do his thing on offense.